What is your experience with force fins?

I have Adjusted it as far as it will go , and I still get that sloppy feel and my foot will come out of the fin in wind , you can actually feel the fin rotating to the right or left and I am not using a dive bootie as it is just to small and I cannot tighten the buckle down far enough . I am to the point where you can step on the heel strap if you dont wrap it back in on itself , I have adjusted my buckle placement and the fin still feels sloppy no matter where i put it .

WES

Misfitdog wrote:I have Adjusted it as far as it will go , and I still get that sloppy feel and my foot will come out of the fin in wind , you can actually feel the fin rotating to the right or left and I am not using a dive bootie as it is just to small and I cannot tighten the buckle down far enough . I am to the point where you can step on the heel strap if you dont wrap it back in on itself , I have adjusted my buckle placement and the fin still feels sloppy no matter where i put it .

WES

Wes, an idea comes to mind. Can you build up the thickness of that cupped neoprene material, that covers the top of the foot? Using rubber sheet of some kind, or neoprene from?????? A old pair of waders........dive suit, neoprene wader rock guards......ect? Any material with cushioning properties, and can be saturated in water would be a good candidate.

To me, that sounds like the area to focus for a permanent fix. Since there is no further adjustment (smaller) in the strap.

Reporting back. Spent 10 straight hours in the saddle, kicking the entire perimeter of the lake I fished. Maybe 3 miles around. Calm winds to begin with, with intermittent spurts of wind throughout the day.

The force fin twisting was gone, loose feeling........gone! Awkward feeling......gone.

Forgot to bring the hand held GPS. Bummed about that! I needed to get a average speed reading to compare against the other 3 pairs of fins I have.

My knee caps began to feel strain after about the 5th hour. That pain would come and go. But would feel it during the kick. I tried short flutter kicks, to long strokes beginning perpendicular (90degrees) to the front edge of the seat, to an extension angle of about 45 degrees or slightly less. Doing that motion here, while sitting causes pain under the right knee cap.

I was able to cover a lot of ground with the force fins. But did not feel significantly faster than my Aquafins. Seemed very similar in that regard. Where this style of force fin (adjustable top strap) did stand out. Was during installing and removing.

To use my Aquafins, a pair of wading shoes are permanently fitted inside the fins. I slip my foot inside and out of the wading shoes after loosing and tightening the laces.

Motoboat, great report and thanks!!
10 hours of kicking for me would end with an ambulance ride, so a little stress under the knee will need further comparisons. How do you feel the Force Fins compare to the Aquafins in the area of maneuverability?

Jerdon wrote:Motoboat, great report and thanks!!
10 hours of kicking for me would end with an ambulance ride, so a little stress under the knee will need further comparisons. How do you feel the Force Fins compare to the Aquafins in the area of maneuverability?

I do not feel the Force fins are any more maneuverable, than either of the 3 pairs of fins I have, which are in no particular order:

CADDIS SWIM FINS 19 1/2" ADJUSTABLE fins
20" CADDIS FLOAT TUBE FINS.
Aqua Lung Blades 2

There is at least a 6" difference between the two Caddis fins. For that reason, the measurement given in the item description is deceiving.

The other major plus for the force fin, is the ability to walk forward on land while wearing them. I am not saying walking will be easy peasy, but doable with caution. Can not walk forward while in the water with any of the mentioned brands.

Now that I have tried the Force fins with adjustable top. Both, when adjusted too loosely, and when adjusted correctly. I am not going to entertain purchasing the molded top force fin version. The twisting of the force fins while kicking in water. Would require to much fiddling around to properly fit to the shoe used. The chances that your foot size and wading shoe combination is "just right" when each size of force fin covers a 1.5 to 2 shoe size range. Leaves to much room for a sloppy feel, and the dreaded twisting on the foot. Which, either of is something I could not get use too.

I did a sustained kick range of 80-90percent of maximum out put. For a couple of minute duration. Although, without my GPS. I had not idea how fast I was going. But, I could compare the wake the boat was leaving on the surface of the water. Of the three fins mentioned, the Aqua lung would be the only brand to come very close in wake size.

Tomorrow I plan on a GPS top speed test run, with the force fins. Again, the speed test is only being used for efficiency comparison between the fins mentioned here.

East test will have been completed in calm winds, on a lake, using the same fish cat float tube.

The fish cat, will be filled until a 1/2" depression is achieved when pressing a thumb down onto the middle of each bladder. Same 235lb body used in each fin test to date. Although, this morning I weighed in at 231.7. A fly rod, with one fly box, fish finder, transducer and 3lb battery to power it. Nothing in the front storage area of the float tube.

Oh, since the test of the last pair of fins (Aqua ling) there is a piece of 3/8" plywood under the seat foam. To help counter the "taco effect". There is a 3/8" piece of foam on top of the two piece foam blocks. This makes me taller in the seat. I would think the weight loss, and less drag of the seat, might benefit in the overall speed test.

This would require that I re-test the Aqua lung fins. Since that top speed has been determined, and was before the slight weight loss and seat mod.

I am expecting the force fins to come on around 1.7mph. The Aqua lungs came in at 1.2mph before mods and weight loss. The shortest Caddis brand of fins, at .6mph.

I wear the fins and shoes as shown below. The shoes go over my waders. I believe the shoes are 9.5 and the fins are XL. I have never once felt like I was going to lose a fin and I've been in some sketchy stuff.

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.:LOLLY:. wrote:I wear the fins and shoes as shown below. The shoes go over my waders. I believe the shoes are 9.5 and the fins are XL. I have never once felt like I was going to lose a fin and I've been in some sketchy stuff.

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I do not recall, did you mention the force fins were twisting when kicking?

That is my concern when I was considering purchasing that (pre-formed) style of force fin.

Okay, round two of my borrowed force fin experience/review. Went to a lake yesterday morning. Calm conditions, not even a breeze to begin my fishing. The force fins did not achieve a 1.7 mph top speed, like I had predicted. Could not achieve 1.6, nor 1.5, or 1.4. In fact, 1.3 was achieved only briefly. 1.2 being a consistent top speed.  

Also noted during the 4 hours of float tube fishing with the force fins, was cruising speed/trolling speed of .4 to .6 mph. That is the kicking speed that I could obtain if fishing for a 9 hr, non stop kicking marathon! Also to note, was the knee pain from the other day was an instant irritant, and continued throughout the 4 hours on the water. The wind did kick up to perhaps 8-10mph. That wind resulted in a slight chop on the water. That resistance could be felt when kicking into the wind. Knee pain was most noticeable. But was able to change up the kicking stroke to eliminate most of the knee stress. But not all of it.  

I was hoping today's conditions would be mild. To re-test the Agualung Blade 2 for another comparison with the Force fin. So, each trip would be fresh in my mind. I am happy to report, that was just the case!

Cruising speed/comfortable trolling speed for the Aqualung was .4 - .6mph.  With .7 and .8 mph occurring often, without trying to speed up. This increased speed rarely occurring with the force fin. I can only surmise the longer fin length was the reason for this. I did not feel either was more maneuverable than the other. Yesterday, I thought the force fins were easier to walk forward in, on dry land, and in water. But today confirmed there was no noticeable difference between the two fin brands.  The Aqualung is a slower more deliberate kicking stroke, taking slightly more effort. But it is as if the body adjusts, perhaps due to less kicks per minute, although requiring slightly more effort.

Let's touch upon the knee pain. I thought the longer fin length of the Aqualungs would exasperate the knee pain, exponentially! Imagine my surprise when there was no knee strain felt........why? The stress point was moved up hill, from the knee to the thigh muscle. Wow! Could not believe that. That might better explain why the extra stroke effort did not translate to being more tired. A more focused area of a larger muscle group was being used, and pain free!

The pain felt under the knee cap with the force fins was grueling to endure.

For some reason, the last time I speed tested the Aqualung I reached a sustained 1.2mph, and an occasional 1.3. Today, 1.1mph, with an occasional 1.2mph was the max speed when I began the day. After 2.5 hours later, a sustained 1.2 was reached. But the energy required to sustain the top speed during all testing is 30 seconds. So, again top speed was used solely for efficiency of the fins. When fighting a head wind, what could one expect from a given fin.

MotoBoat wrote:

.:LOLLY:. wrote:I wear the fins and shoes as shown below. The shoes go over my waders. I believe the shoes are 9.5 and the fins are XL. I have never once felt like I was going to lose a fin and I've been in some sketchy stuff.

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I do not recall, did you mention the force fins were twisting when kicking?

That is my concern when I was considering purchasing that (pre-formed) style of force fin.

No they were not twisting. It just felt awkward since it feels different while kicking do to the shape of the fin.

You use different muscles in your legs due to the fact that the fins are shaped different. With the longer dive fins you have to use more of your leg and your feet (fins) are closer to the surface. With the force fins it's more of a backwards bicycle kick and your feet are a little deeper in the water column.

Your fitness level may play a part in your knee pain. The more you tube the stronger your knee/legs will get and hopefully the pain will be non-existent.

.:LOLLY:. wrote:You use different muscles in your legs due to the fact that the fins are shaped different. With the longer dive fins you have to use more of your leg and your feet (fins) are closer to the surface. With the force fins it's more of a backwards bicycle kick and your feet are a little deeper in the water column.

Your fitness level may play a part in your knee pain. The more you tube the stronger your knee/legs will get and hopefully the pain will be non-existent.

The "backward bicycle" is a actual fin kick term? If you made that up......nice job!

I would like to know of the different kick techniques possible? I have done 3 that I can think of. I have not names to associate the fin movement, so will describe the motion.

1) Pendulum kick-feet and legs are the pendulum of the
grandfather clock.

2) Flutter kick-Ankle movement only. Leg angle anywhere between 90 to 120 degrees (fins under the surface).

3)Extended pendulum kick-Same as pendulum. But the foot is not 90 degrees/straight down. But stretched further away, so the fin tip is closer to the surface of the water.

4)Sitting stair stepper kick. Like if sitting at the Stair stepper machine, at the gym.

To me, the reverse bicycle would involve the combination of the pendulum, and the raising of the knee above the seat. To make a circular motion of the fins.

The pendulum is most efficient for me, and the most coordinated. Anytime the knees are raised above the seat level, the boat rocks, boat slows down, extra energy is expended, just does not feel right or efficient.

I did consider that the knee pain was the result of the need for muscle strengthening.

But, I asked myself "why was the pain concentrated under the knee cap"?

"Why did the pain disappear after a next day fin change, using the same kicking stroke, during calm conditions, bladder air fill and float tube weight the same".

I should be more clear. There is a muscle to each side of the knee cap. Those were not burning, causing the pain. The pain was directly under the knee cap. Pain on the left side was noticeably worse than that of the right side.

To me the pain was like doing something incorrectly. Like, lifting something from the floor while bent over, using your back muscles. Instead of bending the knees, and using the legs.

I did try different things to elevate the pain felt using the force fin. A deeper, shorter kick did help. Two days later, using the force fins, irritated the knees again.

Very next morning. Using a differently constructed fin, and the same kicking stroke that caused the pain the days before. Nothing! Not even a hint of soreness or residual pain.

For me, the only real positive for the force fin, as compared my Aqualung, is compactness, and ease of placing on the feet.

I have no experience with the molded top force fin. But I would prefer the one size (for the most part) fit all, adjustable size that the strap/buckle force fin model provides (has two adjustable straps).

Fin length of the Aqualung is much longer than the force fin.

Maybe force fins just aren't for you then. Fins is one of those personal preference type of things. Work for some and not so much for others.

You might as well put a trolling motor on your tube if your trying to haul a$$ they weren't designed to go fast .With any fins it's all about what your legs can do maybe tubing just isn't for you buy a boat

Don't waste your money on fins this is what I use.
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dosomedirt wrote:You might as well put a trolling motor on your tube if your trying to haul a$$ they weren't designed to go fast .With any fins it's all about what your legs can do maybe tubing just isn't for you buy a boat

I have a 8ft pram, with oars, and a electric motor. It does haul arse if needed.

The whole speed/fin type comparison is explained in the beginning of this thread.

If I wanted speed, I would modify a electric motor to work on the tube.

I mostly hike the tube into places not possible with a boat.

Maybe others have wondered how fast they were traveling with various types of fins, and when casually fishing. Or when setting sail, hell bent for the boat ramp. Maybe they did not have a hand held gps at there disposal to determine there speed.

If a lake I intended to fish was 3 miles around. And I planned on fishing the entire lake shore. If my fins casually moved the boat at .5 miles an hour. It might be smart to know, it would take 6 hours (minimum) to accomplish. It is also advantagous to know what your fins have in reserve, for making up time! Or dealing with wind, or pain, or on a timeline, or pull a water skier...........  

If your not one of them, clearly noted.

.:LOLLY:. wrote:Maybe force fins just aren't for you then. Fins is one of those personal preference type of things. Work for some and not so much for others.

Perhaps! What was discovered, was force fins are an efficient fin for there size. Good for float tubing. More expensive than many fins, and perhaps no more efficient than a fin costing 1/3 there retail price.

However, purchased used in the 50 buck range or less, would be a good deal.

But I am no longer wondering if they are a $250.00 miracle fin. Even with a force fin, a float tube is slow compared to a pontoon boat or any device with a pair of oars.

Next time out in the tube, it is time to give the kayak paddle a go. Paddling solely with the paddle, and in tandem with fins. Should prove to be a coordination type effort, between hands and the feet.

When I float tube I have never PLANNED to go more than 1/2 mile from my launch spot, sometimes a bug hits or conditions change that makes me go farther, but if I was planning on covering more than 2 miles I'd get a boat.

My wife got a set of adj. force fins and really liked them. Then I got a set of flip fins so we tried both. The force fins require less effort per stroke but you have to kick more to get the same result. the flip fins are harder to kick but you get more results. She now uses the flipfins also. I love the FF's for the ease of adj., power,quality, and ease  getting them on & off, but since I sit in my tube to put them on , the flip feature is sort of a non starter. You could probably save $$$ getting regular divers fins.

tronarat wrote:My wife got a set of adj. force fins and really liked them. Then I got a set of flip fins so we tried both. The force fins require less effort per stroke but you have to kick more to get the same result. the flip fins are harder to kick but you get more results. She now uses the flipfins also. I love the FF's for the ease of adj., power,quality, and ease  getting them on & off, but since I sit in my tube to put them on , the flip feature is sort of a non starter. You could probably save $$$ getting regular divers fins.

Could you tell "HOW" much more results the FlipFin had over the ForceFins? As in faster by a lot, a little, 10 percent?

I have been using a set of FlipFins for about 6 weeks now. My findings are similar, but I really cant say they are faster other than in an ALL OUT effort. I'm getting ready to do a report and just wondered if you had a side by side example.

Sort of hard to quantify, but I got the same response from a couple of scuba guys I used to work with. No choir of angels but noticeable . Ask people about southern wyoming and wind is probably going to be one of the first two things they talk about.